The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

[echopulse]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

Unfortunately when it comes to Relativity if it's released solely by them it's not uv. If it's distributed by a uv company like fox then there is a chance of it being uv like Haywire was. So technically haywire would have been their first uv title and unfortunately nothing's changed yet. Relativity is the oddball, grab bag of the UV scene.

I just realized that Haywire was released by Lionsgate on disc, and the package said digital copy, not Ultraviolet. The Family is being released by Fox, and the package states DigitalHD/Ultraviolet. So I agree it will be UV only. Fox has said themselves they would no longer do iTunes copies. I don't know why the Wolverine included it, but it's probably because it already had it's features nailed down before they made that decision. So it's probably the last one.

[madmod20061]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

I just realized that Haywire was released by Lionsgate on disc, and the package said digital copy, not Ultraviolet. The Family is being released by Fox, and the package states DigitalHD/Ultraviolet. So I agree it will be UV only. Fox has said themselves they would no longer do iTunes copies. I don't know why the Wolverine included it, but it's probably because it already had it's features nailed down before they made that decision. So it's probably the last one.

I'm not so sure about that. I think Percy Jackson will be the test for Fox. All of the major releases lately up until The Wolverine included both. The Heat, Croods, Turbo, The Internship, Epic. Percy will be the next major, non Relativity release on December 17th.

Also, like I mentioned before, the Family and Percy Jackson have the same exact DigitalHD writing that The Wolverine does on Amazon and that has an Itunes. It's not my chart and the OP can make changes as he sees fit, but it's just my personal opinion that we are writing off Fox/Relativity itunes to quickly.

[Walter-S_North_Carolina]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

I'm not so sure about that. I think Percy Jackson will be the test for Fox. All of the major releases lately up until The Wolverine included both. The Heat, Croods, Turbo, The Internship, Epic. Percy will be the next major, non Relativity release on December 17th.

Also, like I mentioned before, the Family and Percy Jackson have the same exact DigitalHD writing that The Wolverine does on Amazon and that has an Itunes. It's not my chart and the OP can make changes as he sees fit, but it's just my personal opinion that we are writing off Fox/Relativity itunes to quickly.

fair point. Disney too uses the DigitalHD nomenclature on their packaging. It is not a UV exclusive term.

I will find out when "The Family" hits physical distribution.

The argument is rather straining at a nat and swallowing a camel though. iTunes has seen the digital copy market evaporate in front of their eyes. The bond market has taken notice, since so much of the company's (Apple Corp.) profit margins are tied to iTunes. If some low tier studio is UV exclusive or if they offer both iTunes and UV is a moot issue. The big issue is they (iTunes) has no studio left who will offer digital copy exclusively through them anymore when that was not the case just about 18 months ago. Back then, the majority of the market was iTunes exclusive.

The reversal is historic.

[Grey Ghost]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

... iTunes has seen the digital copy market evaporate in front of their eyes. The bond market has taken notice, since so much of the company's (Apple Corp.) profit margins are tied to iTunes. If some low tier studio is UV exclusive or if they offer both iTunes and UV is a moot issue. The big issue is they (iTunes) has no studio left who will offer digital copy exclusively through them anymore when that was not the case just about 18 months ago. Back then, the majority of the market was iTunes exclusive.

How much profit is made by the service provider on digital copies that come with DVDs or Blurays?

You seem to be linking Apple's loss of exclusivity on digital movie code inserts with a decrease in profits by their iTunes store and a decrease in digital sales. Do you have data to support this or do you mean to imply something different?

Maybe Apple has data that says for movies that we don't give away redemption codes with DVDs and Blurays we see an increase in digital sales compared to movies in which there is an iTunes code?

[echopulse]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

I don't think apple is losing too much money directly because of this. I know a lot of people who will skip buying the blu-ray because it doesn't come with an iTunes code. Instead they will just buy the digital copy straight from the store. Of course these people are probably in the minority. It sure beats the amounts the studio's are giving them I'm sure. You know they aren't paying full price. They are however probably losing money indirectly, because they aren't getting any new users buying into the iTunes video store. People just getting into digital video are probably going with UV because it's included.

[Walter-S_North_Carolina]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

Loosing money......????...... Humm

Here is the long answer.

A company can use either stock or bonds to raise capital. How a stock price is tied to a company performance is a complicated matter. The only true direct connection is the prospect of the issuance of dividends (this is from the mouth of a Dr. of Economics from Cambridge). Therefor, it is the prospect of dividends which affects stock price, along with a lot of subjective economic formulas used by investors.

Bonds are inversely related to stocks in attractiveness. The bond market as a whole and the stock market as a whole are inversely related, but a company bond price in the open market falls as investors forecast an increase risk of default. These are again subjective economic formulas used.

The article I read indicated a direct link in the downgrading of Apple Corp. bond rating in connection to a loss of footing in the iTunes brand. It was explained that since iTunes is tied into almost all of their physical products that a weakening of the iTunes brand as a result of the EST market competition from Amazon and UltraViolet is causing investors to become nervous.

Now, this does not affect Apple Corp. from being able to turn a profit. It just affects the cost for them to raise capital in the open market.

hope that answers your question.

[echopulse]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

I'd like to see that article. Apple admits it barely breaks even on digital content. They use that to drive sales of hardware, and the app store and music store is all they need for that purpose.

[Grey Ghost]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

I think you a re putting too much faith in that article. Financial writers often over speculate to try to explain market whims. According to a recent estimate Apple has $147 billion in cash. I would speculate that any downgrade was the result of Apple's stock dropping back from its overinflated peak price.

Also this article says apple got "great rates" in its bond sale earlier this year.

Even if Apple decides it wants to raise more cash in the Bond market, they can easily afford to pay a bit more than they have in the past.

[Walter-S_North_Carolina]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

The company's CoH (cash on hand) was mentioned. Bond speculators are a fickle bunch. It is true their prognosticating are often based on fanciful whims, but their view is more long term then how much CoH is in the bank.

The fact that bond speculators mentioned the threat to Apple's flag ship software store front from Amazon and UltraViolet is what I found interesting.

With the digital copy market having evaporated in front of Apple's eyes, it must give them pause. They were once the defacto standard. Now, the ship has sailed without them, leaving them as a secondary player, at best.

This does not have an effect on their bottom line red ink immediately. It is hard to argue it will not long term though, IMHO. The bond speculators seem to agree.

[Grey Ghost]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

This does not have an effect on their bottom line red ink immediately. It is hard to argue it will not long term though, IMHO. The bond speculators seem to agree.

Can we have a reference for this?

With the digital copy market having evaporated in front of Apple's eyes, it must give them pause. They were once the defacto standard. Now, the ship has sailed without them, leaving them as a secondary player, at best.

Again how important is the digital copy code give away? How much money is made from it if any? Does apple care that it sailed away?

Are Apple itunes Video-on-demand sales falling? Their market share has fallen from 5-10 years ago because there are more players in the market but are their sales numbers dropping?

[echopulse]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

If Disney, Universal, Paramount, and Fox are still shipping discs with iTunes digital copies, then they can't be too concerned. I orginally thought Fox dropped iTunes, but maybe they just dropped the disc based digital copy. Only Warner, Sony, and Lionsgate are UV only. And Sony hasn't had many blockbusters this year either. Also, your chart isn't complete. Universal offers UV, iTunes, and Amazon. I don't know if Paramount does.

[echopulse]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

Relativity will have it's own redemption website. It's not active yet.

www.relativityuv.com

[Walter-S_North_Carolina]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

Can we have a reference for this?

Sure. Let me see if I can dig it up.

Again how important is the digital copy code give away? How much money is made from it if any? Does apple care that it sailed away?

Are Apple itunes Video-on-demand sales falling? Their market share has fallen from 5-10 years ago because there are more players in the market but are their sales numbers dropping?

I can explain it to you. However, I have done so many times and you do not seem to understand. Let's just say the bond market speculators and I agree there is a long term threat for Apple Corp to loose their footing in the emerging EST market.

You seem to believe contrary to the bond market speculators economic analysis. I dare to suggest their credentials are superior to yours.

[Walter-S_North_Carolina]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

...link is on page #9 of this thread.

The title of the article is "Apple Has Greater Chance Defaulting Their Debt Than Microsoft"

[Grey Ghost]

Re: The Demise of iTunes/Apple in the Digital Copy Market:

I can explain it to you. However, I have done so many times and you do not seem to understand. Let's just say the bond market speculators and I agree there is a long term threat for Apple Corp to loose their footing in the emerging EST market.

You seem to believe contrary to the bond market speculators economic analysis. I dare to suggest their credentials are superior to yours.

This is not an explanation or answer for my questions despite your subtle or not so subtle digs. Apple still has a AA rating by the rating services and this article explains it is due to the volatility in the market with competition from Samsung and likely other companies and the fact that Apple is no longer a high growth company. You want to imply it is solely because of the decrease in their share of the digital copy code market. As your article states, the threats to iTunes includes Amazon music, Amazon Prime, Hulu, Netflix, Vudu, Google Play, Google Music, Twitter Music, Pandora, Spotify and Xbox.

Competition is continuing to grow for Apple whether or not they are the lead player in the digital copy code market and also for Vudu and all the other competing services. But the market is growing so revenue for all services will likely increase.

----------------------
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...bt-rating.html

While Apple will probably maintain ?excellent? liquidity, most of its revenue is generated in ?highly competitive markets characterized by rapid technology evolution and short product life cycles,? S&P analysts led by Martha Toll-Reed wrote in a report yesterday.

One of Apple?s chief competitors is Samsung, which in March unveiled the Galaxy S4 to challenge the iPhone in the high-end smartphone market. The Suwon, South Korea-based company is the world?s largest seller of handsets and relies on a strategy of using a wide range of devices. Apple, by contrast, releases a limited number of products each year.

?With consumer technology, whenever we think that this is the greatest product ever, you wait five to 10 years and that company is no longer at the top,? Granovsky of Moody?s said. ?Triple-A is reserved to companies where we believe the business is highly stable.?

?There are some competitive issues at the moment and you see that in their stock price, but that?s not to say they?re not going to generate good cash,? Ping Zhao, an analyst at CreditSights Inc. in New York, said in a telephone interview. ?Apple is about as much of a top-grade as you can get.?