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The Fandango at Home Forums are designed to help viewers get the most out of their Fandango at Home experience. Here, Fandango at Home customers may post information, questions, ideas, etc. on the subject of Fandango at Home and Fandango at Home -related issues (home theater, entertainment, etc). Although the primary purpose of these forums is to help Fandango at Home customers with questions and/or problems with their Fandango at Home service, there are also off-topic areas available within the Fandango at Home Forums for users to chat with like-minded people, subject to the limitations below.

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Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

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  • illuscon
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by NA9D View Post
    Name a private company that releases sales figures. There's nothing unethical about it. Would you want to post your income on this forum for us to know? I didn't think so. Vudu's not a public company. They have no need to post what their revenues are. And even if they did, what difference would it make? Say they are smaller than everyone's expectations. People would get a negative idea. But what if those numbers were larger than Vudu's expectations and Vudu's plans? What if their investors were pleased? Certainly, they would not post their entire business plan for the world (including their competitors) to see.
    There are actually many private companies that release sales figures. An extensive directory of private companies can be found at Hoovers, a Dun & Bradstreet company.

    I would not post my income because I am not asking for consumers to invest in a product - VUDU is. So your argument is specious and I'm sorry to say, dishonest. Certainly, if things were rosy VUDU would announce their financial results happily. That would attract new capital investment. By not releasing any information about their financial status VUDU opens themselves up to these kinds of questions. Even the media has picked up on this disconnect.

    So yes, it is a reasonable question to ask; is it ethical for VUDU to encourage users to purchase films, knowing the only way to watch these films is on a VUDU box and the only way archive these films is on their "cloud". If VUDU goes under, these purchased films are no longer available to the user. In some cases, that could be a significant amount of money lost. I do believe that under VUDU's current business model, with no other way to recoup these purchased films, VUDU owes their user base a blunt and detailed "state of the business" discussion. Especially, in light of current business climate a company should not be perceived as hiding information from their customers.

    Leave a comment:

  • NA9D
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by tamanaco View Post
    W
    My point was not to show specific examples, but to describe what the existing technology in the Vudu box "is" capable of doing. I bet you that the smartcard in the slot of the Vudu is used for identification purposes. Having "any" physical device (card in Vudu slot) tied to authentication facilitates non-repudiation.
    I can pretty much tell you that from what I know the smart card is tied directly to the encryption key for the box.

    I understand perfectly what the technology is capable of. I'm not arguing about that. But we could sit and discuss "shoulds" all day long and it makes not one bit of difference because the way things "should" be is not reality but fantasy. I repeat again: I am not aware of a single smart card device on the market that lets me take and move that card to a different device and get content there. It doesn't happen.

    Leave a comment:

  • NA9D
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by illuscon View Post
    Why doesn't VUDU make some headlines and release sales figures? Why the deafening silence? Don't you all think VUDU owes users at least some blunt discussion on this topic since users have invested their hard earned money and faith in their product?

    Is it ethical to encourage users to buy films that will only play on a VUDU box when this central question has not been addressed?

    Name a private company that releases sales figures. There's nothing unethical about it. Would you want to post your income on this forum for us to know? I didn't think so. Vudu's not a public company. They have no need to post what their revenues are. And even if they did, what difference would it make? Say they are smaller than everyone's expectations. People would get a negative idea. But what if those numbers were larger than Vudu's expectations and Vudu's plans? What if their investors were pleased? Certainly, they would not post their entire business plan for the world (including their competitors) to see.

    Leave a comment:

  • illuscon
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Why doesn't VUDU make some headlines and release sales figures? Why the deafening silence? Don't you all think VUDU owes users at least some blunt discussion on this topic since users have invested their hard earned money and faith in their product?

    Is it ethical to encourage users to buy films that will only play on a VUDU box when this central question has not been addressed?

    Leave a comment:

  • tamanaco
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by NA9D View Post
    I still don't see where that says they are a software only company...Vudu has always been about the software. They told me that nearly 2 years ago and that was before the box was on the market.
    Well, he did not say... second and last.

    Originally posted by NA9D View Post
    In the example above, the box and smart card were still tied together. They just attached the card to the new box.

    You need to give me an example of moving it from place to place.

    I agree with you on the way it "should" be but that's different than the way it is.

    We should have a flat tax of 10 to 15 percent. We don't. It's going to be at 40% for a lot of us real soon...I could engage in shoulds all day.
    My point was not to show specific examples, but to describe what the existing technology in the Vudu box "is" capable of doing. I bet you that the smartcard in the slot of the Vudu is used for identification purposes. Having "any" physical device (card in Vudu slot) tied to authentication facilitates non-repudiation. Having said that... in "my" view... with these components already in the box... Vudu can easily implement (if not already implemented) a secured delivery model with non-repudiation and a mobile identification token (smartcard) in place. That's all.

    Btw, I wonder what is Vudu's recovery policy for purchased content. If I travel with the Vudu box and it's stolen or lost... Will they replaced all the content I purchased and download it to another box?... There might be a hole here as the lost or stolen box would continue to play the content while disconnected.

    I won't be carrying my Vudu box anywhere, but seeing the picture of the IBM PC Portable above reminded me of the days I carried one of those from gate 10 to gate 300 in some far out airport. That thing was heavy... but the dual diskette drives allowed me to run Lotus 123 in one drive while saving the data on the other. My had the amber (plama) screen.

    Leave a comment:

  • NA9D
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by tamanaco View Post
    Well, that's not what Mr. Tony Miranz said in one of his last public announcements. "We're a software company first and foremost,"
    I still don't see where that says they are a software only company...Vudu has always been about the software. They told me that nearly 2 years ago and that was before the box was on the market.

    The concept of Non-repudiation, that I'm talking about, using a physical device (smartcard or any device with the hash) is similar to the ATM machine concept. No one carries an ATM machine with them. Btw, I recall having a cable box from CableVision with a SmartCard and the box failed. The box was replaced, but I kept the same smartcard........
    In the example above, the box and smart card were still tied together. They just attached the card to the new box.

    You need to give me an example of moving it from place to place.

    I agree with you on the way it "should" be but that's different than the way it is.

    We should have a flat tax of 10 to 15 percent. We don't. It's going to be at 40% for a lot of us real soon...I could engage in shoulds all day.

    Leave a comment:

  • redwein
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by davezatz View Post
    CableCARD? RSA Token?
    I can't even remove my cable card from my Tivo and reinsert it without having to call the cable company and re-pair the card. In that process, I have to identify myself as the account owner by giving the last 4 of my social. I know this because I tried it as an "experiment" once.

    Leave a comment:

  • davezatz
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by NA9D View Post
    NO smart card in the world allows you to take that smart card and put it in someone else's box and view content. The D* or E* boxes do not do it, Vudu does not do it, no one's. Maybe that was the original idea, but everyone ended up tying the smart card to the box. The smart card is integral to the encryption key. But since it is tied to the box, it has to be used with that box.
    CableCARD? RSA Token?

    Originally posted by illuscon View Post
    Sorry, I think it's funny that somebody lugs their clunky VUDU box around the country to watch a movie.
    Agreed. The only box I've tried taking with me has been the Roku Netflix box which I was able to toss into my backpack. Unfortunately, the hotel firewall killed that plan.

    Leave a comment:

  • tamanaco
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by NA9D View Post
    1.) I don't know why you think Vudu is now just a software company. That's not what I would characterize as accurate. Just because they want to license the software to other companies' hardware does not mean that they will stop making hardware.
    Well, that's not what Mr. Tony Miranz said in one of his last public announcements. "We're a software company first and foremost," See the "Vudu Accelerates OEM Plans" here http://www.cepro.com/article/after_c..._software/K316

    Btw, until I heard Mr. Miranz... I thought Vudu was a media (video) services aggregator that sold their own hardware.

    Originally posted by NA9D View Post
    2.) NO smart card in the world allows you to take that smart card and put it in someone else's box and view content. The D* or E* boxes do not do it, Vudu does not do it, no one's. Maybe that was the original idea, but everyone ended up tying the smart card to the box. The smart card is integral to the encryption key. But since it is tied to the box, it has to be used with that box.
    The concept of Non-repudiation, that I'm talking about, using a physical device (smartcard or any device with the hash) is similar to the ATM machine concept. No one carries an ATM machine with them. Btw, I recall having a cable box from CableVision with a SmartCard and the box failed. The box was replaced, but I kept the same smartcard. All the Smartcard is doing is to act as something similar to a "unique and physical" user id to assure non-repudiation. Just like an ATM card won't give you any money with just your password because banks enforce non-repudiation with an ATM card. The only things that might be in the card in terms of encryption is the hash and "possibly" the "00XXAA" box id number associated with one's account. If you have intelligent hardware with a powerful CPU you do not do "any" encryption/decryption in the card as smartcards have very slow CPUs (if any).

    Btw, we all know that Vudu introduced this online purchasing service to increase revenues. It is targeted to those clients that like the purchasing model. With physical media like DVDs the content is tied to "mobile" media which give users the flexibility to play their content anywhere they find a DVD player. Vudu needs to compete with that concept in order for their model to be successful. I'm not saying that they have to do it... but if they don't someone else will and will kill their existing model in a flash. Content providers want non-repudiation. You own the DVD you play it anywhere. if you have something like a smartcard tied to the content you purchase, then you can play that content in any player that the smartcard is inserted. No card... no play... non-repudiation fulfilled... content owners and copyright lawyers are happy.

    Leave a comment:

  • RonV
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by illuscon View Post
    Sorry, I think it's funny that somebody lugs their clunky VUDU box around the country to watch a movie.
    VUDU sells a nice case on their web site:

    https://my.vudu.com/buynow/

    Take a look at their travel kit. Also I have a large family so what is another case in the back of the minivan? A laptop case takes up more space...

    Leave a comment:

  • Nded
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by illuscon View Post
    Sorry, I think it's funny that somebody lugs their clunky VUDU box around the country to watch a movie.
    This is clunky:



    The Vudu is not!

    Leave a comment:

  • illuscon
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Sorry, I think it's funny that somebody lugs their clunky VUDU box around the country to watch a movie.

    Leave a comment:

  • redwein
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    Originally posted by Electric Frenzy View Post
    This thread got de-railed 4 posts in....shame. Vudu making global headlines is always good news.


    On the off-topic rants about vudu vs BD, I'll say that I use my Vudu to rent almost everything and then I'll go out and buy it on a disc if I want to own it. There are about 10 movies I'll buy on Vudu but for me it's the best way to rent movies in the world. I didn't buy Vudu with the expectation that I would own 400 movies on one box.
    I completely agree and couldn't have said it any better.

    Leave a comment:

  • Electric Frenzy
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    This thread got de-railed 4 posts in....shame. Vudu making global headlines is always good news.


    On the off-topic rants about vudu vs BD, I'll say that I use my Vudu to rent almost everything and then I'll go out and buy it on a disc if I want to own it. There are about 10 movies I'll buy on Vudu but for me it's the best way to rent movies in the world. I didn't buy Vudu with the expectation that I would own 400 movies on one box.

    Leave a comment:

  • Rusdude
    replied
    Re: Vudu makes Yahoo Headlines on HD Purchases

    For-purchase HDX movies makes it all but certain that external storage support is on the horizon (cloud archiving notwithstanding). We've had people on this forum who filled up the box with SD movies, so HDX will make it even more common.

    Being able to access your content from any VUDU box based on your card is a great idea, but wouldn't appear to be something that studios would sign off on. Some sort of multibox functionality when I could play content from Box1 on Box2 located on same sub-net or something like that is more likely but, again, it's not really up to VUDU but rather content owners who are afraid of/don't grasp the new technology.

    Leave a comment:

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